Could use some opinions on upgrades

Go with the DDR2 1066 set then. Better choice since it does give you the extra option for heavy overclocking.

That's a good mobo, Dunno how well it OCs but it's onboard audio and video is more than enough for your non-gaming needs.
 
Danny Bui said:
Not really. Note that I did say earlier that 2.1V DDR2 1066 RAM is what I'd go for.
Click to expand...

OCZ is shipping the Reaper DDR2 1066 (OCZ2RPR10662GK: http://www.ocztechnology.com/products/memory/ocz_ddr2_pc2_8500_reaper_hpc_edition). The GA-EP45-UD3R has a FSB of 1600/1333MHz and Memory Standard DDR2 1366+/1066. Intel E8400 had a FSB of 1333MHz. Wouldn't it be possible to get everything at 1333?

Any of these PSUs worthwhile?

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...##1##e&list=y&usc=All+Categories&nrp=15&iht=n

Have that gift card for this place so would help $$.

Thanks again. Just about got this done.
 
The "memory standard" category in the newegg spec description is useless. All it means is that the board supports that speed RAM (DDR2-1333). To take advantage of that, you'd have to pump 667Mhz of true FSB into your chip, which most chips can't handle, regardless of the multiplier.

SBMongoos said:
... Wouldn't it be possible to get everything at 1333?
...
Click to expand...

No, because everything is based off of the base, or true, FSB speed. Lets go back to the math behind those numbers...

/*------------- <cut n paste> -------------*/
Formulas for Intel platform @ 1:1 settings: (base FSB speed is SDR, or single data rate)
c × [Base FSB speed] = CPU Clock speed (c = CPU Multiplier)
2 × [Base FSB speed] = RAM speed (DDR: double data rate)
4 × [Base FSB speed] = Effective FSB speed (QDR: quad data rate)

On Intel platforms, running the RAM higher than a 1:1 ratio with the CPU is useless. Here's some possible clock speeds (as always with OC'ing, your results will vary):

E8400: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667, 1333FSB << STOCK
E8400: 9 × 400 = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-800, 1600FSB << Nice OC
E8400: 9 × 450 = 4.0Ghz, DDR2-900, 1800FSB << Good OC
E8400: 9 × 500 = 4.5Ghz, DDR2-1000, 2000FSB << Great OC
E8400: 9 × 533 = 4.8Ghz, DDR2-1066, 2066FSB << WOW OC
/*------------- </cut n paste> -------------*/

Some of those PSUs are good, but all are overpriced. How much is your GC worth?
 
There's absolutely zero reason to go with DDR2 1333Mhz RAM. In addition refer back to post #12 to see how RAM speed and FSB speed are linked. A FSB of 1333Mhz does NOT call for DDR2 1333Mhz RAM.

The only decent PSUs in that list are the Antec Earthwatts and the Thermaltake Toughpower PSUs. The Earthwatts EA500 should be enough for your current system
 
Danny Bui said:
There's absolutely zero reason to go with DDR2 1333Mhz RAM. In addition refer back to post #12 to see how RAM speed and FSB speed are linked. A FSB of 1333Mhz does NOT call for DDR2 1333Mhz RAM.

The only decent PSUs in that list are the Antec Earthwatts and the Thermaltake Toughpower PSUs. The Earthwatts EA500 should be enough for your current system
Click to expand...

Wasn't looking at RAM that's 1333. But if it was possible to set CPU, RAM and Mb to 1333 and have all run at the same frequency. Apparently not.

Currently high on the list is the OCZ Reaper DDR2 1066, GA-EP45-UD3R - FSB of 1600/1333MHz - Memory Standard DDR2 1366+/1066 and the Intel E8400 FSB of 1333MHz. So the RAM and Mb would run at stock 1066 and the E8400 1333. A little confused here as to how this would be set up to actually run.

Reason I ask is I had the option to choose from various DDR2 from OCZ. Since I could get the 1066 it sounded like the way to go based on your remark. Would it have made more sense to do 800 or 667?

As for a PSU it looks like the Corsair makes best sense at this point. BB prices are not so good and it would be a waste to use the gift card. Can that unit still work fine if I choose later to go with a much better video card?
 
SBMongoos said:
... So the RAM and Mb would run at stock 1066 and the E8400 1333. A little confused here as to how this would be set up to actually run. ...
Click to expand...

Ok, I don't think you understand the math. With an E8400, its stock FSB speed is 1333Mhz. That 1333Mhz is the effective FSB, but the true FSB is that number divided by 4, which is 333Mhz.

That true FSB speed determines all the other speeds. For example, your CPU will be running at nine times that, which is 3Ghz. So, your RAM would be running at twice that, which is DDR2-667, if you kept a 1:1 ratio. As stated earlier, you can OC the RAM to DDR2-1333, but its pointless -- there's absolutely no performance difference if the true FSB is still 333Mhz.

The mobo speed is essentially the FSB speed, which is determined by the CPU, unless OC'ing.

GC = Gift Card.
 
enginurd said:
GC = Gift Card.
Click to expand...

About $55 left.

The info is more clear the way you've put it. The question I still have is with the E8400, the GA-EP45-UD3R mb and the DDR2-PC28500. If I simply just plug everything in and run it what speed would I be running at. If I were to tweak it (not max OC) what would make sense to run this system at? I'm likely getting confused with the numbers the manufacturer provides and the effective.
 
E8400: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667, 1333FSB << STOCK

If you plugged everything in without any tweaking, the motherboard may or may not set the RAM to its rated speed, or the default DDR2-667. Everything else will be whatever it says above.

Spend the $55 on a game or two, or whatever, since all those PSU prices are overpriced.
 
enginurd said:
E8400: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667, 1333FSB << STOCK

If you plugged everything in without any tweaking, the motherboard may or may not set the RAM to its rated speed, or the default DDR2-667. Everything else will be whatever it says above.
Click to expand...

So it's a waste having DDR2/1066Mhz RAM? No gain?

Key here (not sure if you read this) is that OCZ is exchanging RAM on a warranty issue they never completed. The original stuff was PC3200. The were very cool in being flexible with what I wanted and it sounded like the 1066 made sense. But apparently this is a bad move and I should have actually gone with the 667?
 
SBMongoos said:
So it's a waste having DDR2/1066Mhz RAM? No gain?

Key here (not sure if you read this) is that OCZ is exchanging RAM on a warranty issue they never completed. The original stuff was PC3200. The were very cool in being flexible with what I wanted and it sounded like the 1066 made sense. But apparently this is a bad move and I should have actually gone with the 667?
Click to expand...

If you're buying RAM and don't plan on OC'ing, then no, there's no point in buying DDR2-1066 if you never plan on running the FSB that high. If the RAM replacement is free, then thats a no-brainer, go for the fast stuff -- its free! RAM is easily underclocked. DDR2-1066 will run at DDR2-667 and DDR2-800 as well, so there's no downside to choosing the higher speed ram as a free replacement.
 
Makes sense as it would "downclock", if you will.

If you had this mb, CPU and RAM how would you OC it to take advantage of it?
 
To take full advantage of that speed, I'd go for the "Wow OC" in my table above... or as Danny put it, "EXTREMELY lucky" OC.
 
So it's possible to hit any of these:

E8400: 9 × 333 = 3.0Ghz, DDR2-667, 1333FSB << STOCK
E8400: 9 × 400 = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-800, 1600FSB << Nice OC
E8400: 9 × 450 = 4.0Ghz, DDR2-900, 1800FSB << Good OC
E8400: 9 × 500 = 4.5Ghz, DDR2-1000, 2000FSB << Great OC
E8400: 9 × 533 = 4.8Ghz, DDR2-1066, 2066FSB << WOW OC

Cool. I should have got this sooner. Been very preoccupied lately. Thanks..
 
enginurd said:
Anything is possible. :p is the "WOW OC" Probable? doubt it. the "Great OC" is pushing it.
Click to expand...

Apparently the idea of using the stock fan/heatsync is not a good idea or is it? I assume it may be safe at lower OC rates?
 
Not a good idea. Most stock CPU coolers nowadays can barely handle a mild overclock (of up to, say, 3GHz), if at all.
 
tiraides said:
Not a good idea. Most stock CPU coolers nowadays can barely handle a mild overclock (of up to, say, 3GHz), if at all.
Click to expand...

Okay, so stick with the stock unit if running the stock speed. If not replace it. What do you recommend?

By the way a Corsair 400w PSU was recommended for this. If I OC at some point or put in a decent video card will this be enough? If so great otherwise I'd rather spend a little more, if needed, now instead of buying 2 PSUs.

Can you convert a 500w 20 pin to work on a 24 pin mb?

Thanks again!!
 
tiraides said:
The Antec Sonata series are the only cases (bundled with power supplies) that we recommend, as they come with the Antec Earthwatts series power supplies. There's also the NSK series, but they use an ATX (or microATX) mini-tower design. We normally recommend the Antec Sonata III, but there's also the Sonata Designer and the Sonata Plus 550. But we normally recommend one of those cases if the prices are significantly less than buying a case and (quality) power supply separately.
Click to expand...

BB has the Sonata III but in store only and none in my area. $99 - $56.58 would get me into a new case and that Earthwatts 500w PSU. Bummer! Don't like the door on the front although I can live with that.

Nix this idea. Apparently none are available west of the Mississippi and apparently no more to be had. BB keeps sliding down my list of places to go the last few years. About to nix my BB card after about several years as there's really no point anymore.
 
SBMongoos said:
Okay, so stick with the stock unit if running the stock speed. If not replace it. What do you recommend?
Click to expand...
Xigmatek HDT-S1283 w/ retention kit for easier/more secure installation.
SBMongoos said:
By the way a Corsair 400w PSU was recommended for this. If I OC at some point or put in a decent video card will this be enough?
Click to expand...
Maybe. What's your parts list look like again? and whats the OC goal?
SBMongoos said:
Can you convert a 500w 20 pin to work on a 24 pin mb?
Click to expand...
Thats not a good idea. If its 20-pin, its most likely so old its rails aren't properly equipped with enough amperage for a modern system.
 
enginurd said:
What's your parts list look like again? and whats the OC goal?

Thats not a good idea. If its 20-pin, its most likely so old its rails aren't properly equipped with enough amperage for a modern system.
Click to expand...

Parts list (WinXP Pro setup):

  • GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3R
  • Intel Core 2 Duo E8400
  • OCZ DDR2 PC2-8500 Reaper HPC Edition (2x1g)
  • Sapphire 100233L Radeon HD 3450 256MB PCI-E Video Card
  • or MSI N9600GT 512M OC GeForce 9600 GT (due to current deal $65 with free s/h)
  • or PNY 9600 GSO 768MB PCI-e OC (due to current deal, sale - gift card = $45)
  • CORSAIR CMPSU-400CX
  • or Antec earthwatts EA430 430W (same price as 400cx)
  • or CORSAIR CMPSU-450VX (if I need a little more power)

As for OC'ing it would be one of these. Likely 3.6 or 4Ghz, not sure about 4.5.

  • E8400: 9 × 400 = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-800, 1600FSB << Nice OC
  • E8400: 9 × 450 = 4.0Ghz, DDR2-900, 1800FSB << Good OC
  • E8400: 9 × 500 = 4.5Ghz, DDR2-1000, 2000FSB << Great OC

As for my current PSU. It's a A+GPB ENTERPRISES JGEA70P4. Got it when PC Club was local. Seems to be a good unit and testing good with multimeter.
 
Get the MSI 9600GT, as it's the best video card choice out of the three that you're considering.

If you could afford it, I also recommend getting the Corsair 450VX. Any of those PSU choices would be fine for your needs.
 
SBMongoos said:
As for my current PSU. It's a A+GPB ENTERPRISES JGEA70P4. Got it when PC Club was local. Seems to be a good unit and testing good with multimeter.
Click to expand...

I recommend getting a new PSU nonetheless for the new system. Can't find a single ounce of info about that PSU online. That's usually a bad sign in my experience of the PSU's quality.

If you're willling to buy from a different site, I recommend getting this PSU:
BFG Tech LS-550 550W PSU - $67

Though if you want to stick with Newegg, go with either the 400CX or 450VX.
 
tiraides said:
Get the MSI 9600GT, as it's the best video card choice out of the three that you're considering.

If you could afford it, I also recommend getting the Corsair 450VX. Any of those PSU choices would be fine for your needs.
Click to expand...

I picked up the PNY at BB today. It can always go back. One main reason however is that I had a gift card for BB from last Christmas and 90 day SAC to pay off balance. Keeping the costs down. I know it may seem weird I'm willing to consider other items but I do so if it's a really good deal.

I was leaning toward the Corsair 450VX myself.
 
Danny Bui said:
I recommend getting a new PSU nonetheless for the new system. Can't find a single ounce of info about that PSU online. That's usually a bad sign in my experience of the PSU's quality.

If you're willling to buy from a different site, I recommend getting this PSU:
BFG Tech LS-550 550W PSU - $67

Though if you want to stick with Newegg, go with either the 400CX or 450VX.
Click to expand...

Danny: I though you were big on the Corsair? I'm open. What's your thoughts between the Corsairs and this BFG? I see it's 46 w/MIR. Rebates...ugh. But they get me once in a while.
 
SBMongoos said:
Danny: I though you were big on the Corsair? I'm open. What's your thoughts between the Corsairs and this BFG? I see it's 46 w/MIR. Rebates...ugh. But they get me once in a while.
Click to expand...

I like both companies actually. In fact I'm using a Corsair PSU right now. The Corsair 450VX and the BFG LS-550 are of equal quality with the 400CX a little below them. Main reason why I recommend the BFG LS-550, however, is that it's only $67 from buy.com whereas the 450VX is $70 from newegg.com. Since the LS-550 offers more power on the +12V amperage, it's a no brainer which PSU you should choose if you're willing to buy from a different site.

EDIT: Oh, the BFG LS-550 is only $75 at newegg.com, just $5 more than the Corsair 450VX and comes with free shipping. So I definitely recommend getting the BFG LS-550 over the Corsair 450VX.
 
Danny Bui said:
I like both companies actually. In fact I'm using a Corsair PSU right now. The Corsair 450VX and the BFG LS-550 are of equal quality with the 400CX a little below them. Main reason why I recommend the BFG LS-550, however, is that it's only $67 from buy.com whereas the 450VX is $70 from newegg.com. Since the LS-550 offers more power on the +12V amperage, it's a no brainer which PSU you should choose if you're willing to buy from a different site.

EDIT: Oh, the BFG LS-550 is only $75 at newegg.com, just $5 more than the Corsair 450VX and comes with free shipping. So I definitely recommend getting the BFG LS-550 over the Corsair 450VX.
Click to expand...

So if I OC you recommend a bump in watts then, correct?

Costs:

  • Corsair 450VX: $80 on sale (-$10)/MIR(-$10) = $60 + $11.43 s/h = $71.43 @ Newegg

  • [*]BFG Tech 550W: $64.49 - $20 MIR + $0 s/h = $46.49 @ Buy
  • Corsair 400CX: $65 on sale (-$5)/MIR(-$10) = $50 + $0 s/h = $50.00 @ Newegg
$25 savings!
 
SBMongoos said:
Costs:

Corsair 450VX: $80 on sale (-$10)/MIR(-$10) = $60 + $11.43 s/h = $71.43 @ Newegg
BFG Tech 550W: $64.49 - $20 MIR + $0 s/h = $46.49 @ Buy
$25 savings!
Click to expand...

I'm not factoring in rebate costs since as they are not a guaranteed discount as they can still be rejected, lost, or ignored even if you do everything right. So factor in shipping, the BFG LS-550 is ~$7 cheaper than the Corsair 450VX
 
Danny Bui said:
I'm not factoring in rebate costs since as they are not a guaranteed discount as they can still be rejected, lost, or ignored even if you do everything right. So factor in shipping, the BFG LS-550 is ~$7 cheaper than the Corsair 450VX
Click to expand...

Very true. However, I'm batting a 1000 on rebates after all these years. Had one case where I went to CompUSA itself and they made good on about 6 that PNY messed up on.

Also, the 450vx states: "this unit runs at up to 85% efficiency and 99% Active Power Factor Correction to provide clean reliable power to your system." Is this saying it's more efficient than the BFG? I'm cool with saving on the utilities.
 
Danny:

Looking at a package of the Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3L, Intel E8400 and the BFG LS-550 I can do $319 at Amazon. No s/h and no MIR. Newegg would be the same price but I'd have to mess with two MIRs.
 
SBMongoos said:
Also, the 450vx states: "this unit runs at up to 85% efficiency and 99% Active Power Factor Correction to provide clean reliable power to your system." Is this saying it's more efficient than the BFG? I'm cool with saving on the utilities.
Click to expand...

All it's saying is that the Corsair PSU is very efficient. Nothing at all about the Corsair PSU being more efficient than the BFG.

However testing has shown that the two PSUs pretty much have very similar efficiency:
http://hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTM3NSw0LCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
http://hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTUxNCw0LCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==

Pretty close to one another.

SBMongoos said:
Danny:

Looking at a package of the Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3L, Intel E8400 and the BFG LS-550 I can do $319 at Amazon. No s/h and no MIR. Newegg would be the same price but I'd have to mess with two MIRs.
Click to expand...
Then go with Amazon then.
 
SBMongoos said:
Any experience with Amazon? I've heard mixed reviews since they use different end sources.

Thanks for the info!
Click to expand...

Order from them all the time. Though I usually just order books and only from Amazon itself (Free Super Saver Shipping FTW!), not from the little stores under the Amazon website.
 
If you're worried about future expandability and want more headroom, go with the 550W. It should handle any single GPU/card as well as everything else in your list.
 
LOL, I selected the wrong Mb when checking Buy and Amazon. Newegg is actually cheaper.

Newegg is like the stock market. Deals change frequently on pricing and s/h. Prices now higher.

Hey... this just went on sale. I don't mean to be a pain in the ass. But would you stick with the Corsair 400CX if you could get it for $35 (after MIR of course)? Free s/h as well.
 
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